Spill the Smut
Where the books are spicy, the conversations are juicy, and the stories rarely fade to black. Each week, I dive headfirst into the delicious world of smut with the people who live and breathe it—authors, creators, and bookish babes who aren’t afraid to spill all the steamy tea. Through interviews and unfiltered chats, I'll explore everything from fan-favorites to behind-the-scenes secrets of the bookish world. This is your weekly escape into the world of steam, swoon and unapologetically bookish.
So get comfy. Pour a drink. And get ready to spill the smut.
Spill the Smut
Interview with Plot Twist Marketing: Alyssa
Want to see what happens when a marketer leaves corporate sameness for the wild, fast world of indie romance? Alyssa, founder of Plot Twist Marketing, shares how she builds custom strategies that actually move books: aligning ads, PR, social, and ARC outreach so every touchpoint pulls in the same direction. No boilerplate, no fluff—just smart diagnosis, careful execution, and a deep respect for the reader experience.
Along the way, she drops binge-worthy recs—angsty duets, dark mafia heat, hockey romance, and clever retellings—and a mantra worth stealing: time is precious, waste it wisely.
If you’re an author ready to grow with intention, or an influencer who wants ARCs that match your taste, this conversation is your roadmap to smarter marketing, better targeting, and more joyful launches. Subscribe, share with a romance-loving friend, and leave a review to tell us which trope you want us to tackle next.
Follow Plot Twist Marketing on IG @plottwistmarketing
Cover Art by: moi
Intro/Outro Music: positive vibes by nanaacom on Capcut
Contact Email: spillthesmutpodcast@gmail.com
Podcast IG: @spillthesmutpodcast TT: @spillthesmutpodcast
Jordan IG: @sipsoffiction TT: @sipsoffiction
She's the powerhouse behind her own marketing agency, Plot Twist Marketing. Seriously, could there be a cooler name? Before that, she spent over a decade working in publishing, so she knows every insider trick in the book. Now she's on a mission to give authors, and I quote, the tools, strategies, and execution to grow their careers with confidence. Authors, trust me, you want her in your corner. Please welcome to the podcast. Alyssa. Hi.
Alyssa:Hi, it's so good to be here.
Jordan:Oh my gosh, I'm literally so excited to interview you. So, like, thank you so much for coming on the like my podcast and letting me interview you.
Alyssa:Thank you for the invitation. So exciting.
Jordan:Okay, so before we dive into the questions, I do like to start off with each episode with like what has been the highlight of your week so far? Literally could be anything and everything. But what's your highlight?
Alyssa:Um, I guess really like professionally, um, just really I got I signed on a new client last week. Um, so getting to work on her on her campaigns and really dig into like her books. And um, it was an author who I'd heard of, but I hadn't read yet. So I'm getting to like dig into her backlist and read all of those. And it's just really, it's really fun getting to learn someone new and getting to know their style, what they were doing before I joined, and what we can do to build their career. So that's literally one of my favorite things to do. Um, so it's just it's just been a great time this week uh working on building a new author. I'm new to me authors.
Jordan:Well, no, and that's so cool. I'm like, okay, this is like not the question, but I know I'm probably going to ask more questions. Um, so how like is it just like are you like cold calling people type thing, or do like authors find you and are like, hey, like I want to use your agency? Like, how does that work?
Alyssa:Um, a lot of it's been word of mouth. I've done zero advertising. I literally posted a um TikTok and an Instagram reel the day I started accepting clients and um was able to fill my client roster within six weeks of launching. So um I've literally that's literally all I've done. Um, it's all been word of mouth and just um connections and things I've made um throughout my career.
Jordan:That is amazing. That is truly amazing. That is honestly so cool. Yeah, it's been awesome. Literally no words. Speechless. Okay, so now we can dive into the questions. So I do have this broken up into three parts. So I have your marketing agency, reading, and then personal. So we'll start with the marketing agency, which I do want to like make note that I had so much fun picking out your questions, which might be why there's like multiple questions in one question, because I just I kept thinking of more questions I wanted to ask you. So this could be a little long and I'm sorry, but not sorry. Okay, so what is what is it that you offer with plot twist marketing to an author and to a reader? Because like I know you have your influencer list, but then you have your clients who are authors. So I was just wondering if you could tell me a little more about that.
Alyssa:Yeah, so I just really help authors get their books into in front of the right readers. So for authors, that's strategy, that's advertising, that's influencer outreach, that's reaching out to podcasters like yourself, um, and and just really all the behind-the-scenes stuff. So there are a couple of clients that I actually um manage uploading their their ebooks and making sure their keywords are correct and um and uploading their paperbacks and ordering paperbacks, connecting them with bookstores um if they want to set up um like a pre-order through a bookstore. So that I do all of that for my authors. Um, and then for readers, it's really just making sure they discover new books um in fun ways, like maybe through fun pre-order campaigns through their favorite bookstore or fun uh PR boxes to like influencers and stuff, and maybe even some podcasters um if they want to like share on their uh social media and stuff that they got like a fun PR box with stickers and a signed copy and all sorts of things.
Jordan:So oh my goodness. So is it safe to say that you kind of do you do different things for different authors depending on like what they're looking for? Or is it kind of the same sort of I don't content's not the right word? Is it the same sort of okay, you're uploading everybody's ebook paperback? So it's different.
Alyssa:My yeah, my agency um is it is different for every author, and that's kind of the way I built it. Um, because when I was in traditional publishing, it all was cookie cutter, and like every author almost got the exact same thing, and and my days got really boring, and that's what I hated. Like I loved traditional publishing, don't get me wrong, and I really loved my job and my colleagues there. Um, but it really just got boring after a while. Like I was just tired of doing the same old thing. Um, I was tired of being in constant meetings all the time, meetings for the meetings and meetings for the other meetings, and I was just like over it. Um, and so when I broke out and decided to go freelance, my biggest thing was it was going to be unique to each author. That's why authors don't find like a price list on my website. They find services that I can do, um, and then I tailor their package to them. Like some authors don't need advertising. They have um an ad person that they've been working with for years, but they want like the overall marketing strategy. They want someone to come in and look down and figure out where they're missing um marketing strategy and where they can grow and where they can do better. And that's working with their team, not not trying to butt heads with their team. That's working with their team to figure out what ad strategies can be improved, um, what social media can be improved and things like that. So it's just really tailored to each author. So it's not one author is the same. Each one of them has their own package.
Jordan:Oh, okay. So then that would mean too, like, and I so sorry if I ask any dumb questions. I'm just prefacing that. So you I like want to point out too, then so you're not like a PA. That's something completely different, correct?
Alyssa:No, I did that in a previous live. Um, and don't get me wrong, PAs are phenomenal and they definitely have their place. I I, as one before I went into traditional publishing, was a PA for an author who I adore and I'm still friends with to this day. Um, but no, I typically will work alongside a PA and make sure that their social media strategy is um aligned with our marketing strategy and our PR strategy, and just making sure that nothing is clashing and everything is working together. So I'm coming in and just really meshing everything together mostly because most of the PAs are taking care of their so their author's social media. Um, and and so just kind of making sure that everybody is aligned and um the author can really just focus on writing instead of managing a team.
Jordan:Oh, okay, that's really cool. Um, okay, so then what inspired you to start plot twist marketing and how did you come up with the name for the agency? And is this always something you wanted to do, or did you fall into it? Sorry, this was the one that had like a ton of questions.
Alyssa:You're fine. Um, I I did kind of fall into it. Um, like I said earlier, I had a freelance agent or a freelance company where I was a PA and a cover designer um before starting uh before going traditional. Um so after one of my it and I went traditional after one of my main clients decided to retire. Um, the world had shut down because of the pandemic, and a lot of uh remote roles were popping up in traditional publishing, which was the silver lining of COVID, you know, if there ever is one. Um a lot of companies realized that they could do remote work. And so it it instead of me having to move to New York, which I was never gonna do, it opened up an entirely new world to me. Um and a world that would have never been opened before that. Um, so a remote role opened up right at the time my main client decided to retire. And I was like, okay, let's let's try this out. And I did um for three and a half years. Absolutely loved everything about it, uh, except for the corporate structure. I just like I said, it got it gets really monotonous, it gets really boring, and everything is so cookie-cutter. Um, so I miss the indie side of the industry. Um the indie side just moves so much faster. Uh, an author can go from announcing a book eight weeks out, not it it not even being written, and then publishing it within eight weeks. And you don't get that with traditional publishing. It usually takes like six months is a stretch goal. You usually need 12 to 18 months um from the time an editor acquires a book to the time it actually hits shelves. Um, so we have a much shorter timeline. Um, authors are more at indie authors are more agile when it comes to publishing. Um, it's very different. Each author likes to do things a different way. So figuring out how I can work into what they're already doing and build on that and make it better. Um so I was just really inspired to start Plot Twist because I wanted to take the experience that I built before I went into traditional publishing, while I was in traditional publishing, and just really bring it back to a space where I could make a bigger impact overall.
Jordan:Oh, I like that. And I think too, like I just want to like make this point that I think I agree with you, traditional publishing, it takes like a lot longer. So not saying that authors need to hit a trend, but if authors want to do something that falls within a trend, whether it's something I I don't know, literally anything, I feel like an indie author can do that better because they can get the book out faster. And where like traditional, traditionally published books, if they want to hit a trend, I almost feel like the trend will be over by the time the book actually comes out. And you can tell that, oh, this was a trend, and the editor picked it up at a time that was probably really good if it came out right then and there, but a year and a half down the line, it's not quite a trend anymore.
Alyssa:Correct. It it authors, indie authors are definitely able to hit what is popular in the moment, and our world moves so fast. Um, so a lot of times by the time a popular trend comes around, the traditional publishing has missed the mark. Now, I will say, um, like I worked uh both of the companies that I worked at before um were actually very good at picking up indie authors who were publishing trends at the time and were able to get them out on shelves quickly. Um so that was one of the things that was a lot of fun to work on. Um, and I I learned a lot in that process. Um, but I I did work on the longer campaigns as well. Uh so there are publishing houses that are really good at picking out trends and getting them on the shelves quickly. Um, but it's still rare. Like you you got your Anna Wongs and your Bryn Weavers who suddenly got picked up um because they were writing trends and um they took off from there.
Jordan:So yeah, no, yeah, exactly. Um does your marketing agency cater to a certain genre? Do you have authors that write a little bit of everything? And apologies, like I kind of meant this as in like the romance, like I know you most I'm assuming you mostly do romance, but I wasn't I meant like genres within romance. Oh, does that make sense? Like romantic, like okay.
Alyssa:See blood twist marketing does only uh take on romance authors. That that is where I thrive, that's what I know best, that is the market. Like you're not gonna see me trying to market a mystery because I just don't, I just don't know that market as well. Um, so I wanted to focus on where I thrive. But as for like sub-genres within the romance, um, no, wide array. Um, I have um an author who is getting ready to publish a sci-fi romance, which is fun. I love sci-fi, it's like dystopian. Um, so into the world, um, which is gonna be a lot of fun. It comes uh in February next year, uh, from Hannah Hayden, who is um a pin name for Sienna Snow. So that's a lot of fun. It's gonna be so good. Um, I got the first chapter the other day, and it's just oh people aren't ready for this book, but it is so good. Um, and uh I have some that are doing mafia romance and billionaire romance and enemies to lovers, and we get all tropey and everything. So yeah, within as long as it's within the romance genre, um, I work on it all.
Jordan:Oh, perfect. Okay, that's fun. Um, what does a typical day in the office look for look like for you?
Alyssa:Um, so it really depends. Some mornings I dive into my ad dashboard because I want to see how ads are doing, whether it be on Meta or TikTok or um Amazon or BookBub or Reddit, wherever we're running ads, I usually like to look at those first thing in the morning to see if we had any drop-offs overnight. Um, but other times I'm brainstorming campaigns or jumping into check-in calls with my authors. Um, we I keep in constant contact with them. A lot of them I check in with weekly. So I have a lot of meetings to make sure that everyone is still on the same page and things haven't changed and stuff like that. So really um no day ever looks the same.
Jordan:And that's kind of exciting because I know too, you were saying how before it got very boring. Yeah. So like now it's kind of like exciting that you don't know what the new day will ex like you don't know what to expect for every day then. Yeah. Well, and then too, like, because I did want to ask, because like I noticed you do out you send out arcs. So is that part of like your marketing of oh, okay. So like sending out different arcs for different authors type thing.
Alyssa:Yes. And now some of the authors have a straight team and they don't want me doing influencer outreach, but I do work directly with their street team or their PA does. Um, but then there's some authors who's like, yeah, hand out as many as you want. Um, so it it really depends on the author's preference, and that's that's kind of where the one of the differences that come in with each author. Like I have one author who is like, I I don't want to give more than 150 arcs, and then I have another author who's like, my street team is 400 people, and I'm fine with giving even more than that. So um, so it just really depends on the author's preference.
Jordan:Oh, okay. Is there a client of yours that you need everyone to stop what they're reading to read their book? And like what book is it? That's like picking a favorite child. I know. So if you want to give a few authors, I totally understand. Um, I'm gonna give a few authors. I love it. I love it.
Alyssa:Um, so uh so Gwyn McNamee um is uh well, is obviously they're all new because I've only been I've only had this company for two months now. So um so Gwen McNamee just released um My Sweetest Agony, which is a super angsty romance where the main character falls for her dead fiance's twin brother.
Jordan:About the drama. I love drama.
Alyssa:I mean, it is angsty and it's a duet. Um, but luckily she is releasing book two at the end of this month. So there's not a long wait time. You can read read both of them back to back. And I'm I'm telling you, they're so worth it. Um, I'm not gonna go into any spoilers because anything else that I say aside from that is a spoiler, but it is so good. Um, and then I have Sienna Snow, which I mentioned um her dystopian romance is coming in February, but she also uh under her main pin name Sienna Snow, um, just released a steamy mafia romance called Forbidden Empire. Um, and it is a lot of fun, uh, really dark, really sexy. Um, so be prepared for some some steamy scenes. Um, and then of course, some morally gray alpha heroes.
Jordan:We do love a morally gray character.
Alyssa:Me too. Um, and then Ruth Steeling is my new, my newest uh client. She has her fourth book in her Blade Kings hockey romance series called Full Tilt that um releases later this month. Um so October, we're in October, and I know this. So by the time this episode releases, they will already have been released. Um that's exciting. New reads for everybody. New reads for everybody. Um, and then the fourth one I want to talk about is um Jennifer Rebecca. Um, it's coming in November. Um, so I guess this month. Um, and it is her second book in her royal romance retelling. Um, and it it's dark, also has a morally great character, an arranged marriage. Um a lot of fun. I just I love a good royal retelling.
Jordan:Oh mm-hmm. Um, can I ask you how many clients you have in total? I have four. Okay, and how many are you willing to take on? Like no, I love that because I I was I was curious too, because you probably do so much for them that I'm like, I don't know if you're like trying to keep your like client list small or because I'm assuming it's just you too, or do you have me?
Alyssa:It is just me at the moment. Um, I may be hiring a social media person soon to kind of help because that that's where I'm the weakest, to be honest, um, is on social media. Um, so someone to come in and help me with my social media and then help me with my author's social medias as well, like their content planning. Um, but yeah, I really wanted to keep my roster super small because I know my limits. Um, and I want to make sure that my authors get all of me and not tiny pieces of me because I've overextended myself.
Jordan:Yeah, you don't want to spread yourself too thin too, and you don't want to feel like your authors aren't getting what they essentially paid for. And yeah, so I totally, I totally understand that. Um, what do you find to be the most challenging in starting your own marketing agency? And what do you find to be the most rewarding?
Alyssa:Um, so the most challenging part is definitely the different hats you have to wear. Um, so when you're in corporate and you're in marketing, you are just marketing. You don't have to worry about anything else. Um, but when you own your own company, you have to do admin duty, you have to do accounting, your own tech support. Um, if your computer breaks, you can't just call IT and be like, fix it. Um, and they tell you to turn it off and turn it back on, because that's typically the fix.
Jordan:That's all that's the first thing that like my IT, like where I work, does the same thing. And I'm like, yes, I already turned it on and back off and back on. It's still broken. Help right.
Alyssa:That that's always the first fix they tell you to do, and you've already done it four times. Um, but you know, when you own your own business, you are your own IT, you have to figure it out yourself. Good luck. Um, so so all of that, um, you're juggling a million things at once, um, especially with multiple clients. And then with the added um pressure of each, knowing that each client isn't a cookie cutter client, they each have their own needs and goals that you have built their their plan around. Um, so again, juggling a million things. It's it's overall so rewarding though, because you're getting to see up close and personal the real-time difference you're making in an author's career. Um, and it really just makes all the chaos worth it. Um, you're you're right up next to them, you're seeing the numbers in real time coming through, you're seeing their sales, their pre-orders, everything because you're so in constant contact with them, you're getting to to see all that information in real time.
Jordan:Okay, that that has to be that I get that.
Alyssa:Like just to see like the success of gratification, which everybody loves.
Jordan:Honestly, it's why I go get a coffee every day. Like, yep. Um, okay, so what advice do you have for someone that wants to start their own marketing agency?
Alyssa:To start. I mean, um, it's gonna be messy, but I promise the outcome is worth it, especially if you have the knowledge and the skills already. Um, I assume if someone is wanting to start their own agency, they do. Um, but you'll learn systems as you go. Nothing has to be perfect starting out. Um, I I say just do it because you can try to you can spend a year planning exactly how you want your system to to look and go, and it will fall off the rails in two days because it doesn't actually work for what you're wanting to do. Um, so your systems and things will will come. Um, your branding can evolve over time. It doesn't have to be perfect starting out. Um, so really my biggest piece of advice is just to do it.
Jordan:Okay. Now I'm gonna kind of spin the this. Well, I have another question not on the list, but I'm gonna kind of spin it. So I know you've only been doing this for two months, but what have you learned right like in these two months that you wish you knew when you started?
Alyssa:That um I that people really understood my value. Um I I completely undervalued myself and um I was really nervous because I had a very limited amount of time, um, a very limited amount of runway to make sure that my home, my home household bills and things were paid. Um, so it was really a mad dash. Um, and I was really worried that um my prices were gonna be too much. Um, but it turns out that um it wasn't. People are gonna pay for for your knowledge and for your skill and um and not don't to really advise for anyone is to just don't undervalue yourself. Um you know the you know what it takes to do what you love doing and you know how to what am I trying to say?
Jordan:You know what you bring to the table. You know what you bring to the table.
Alyssa:And your your experience and your knowledge goes way further than you may realize yourself.
Jordan:Yeah, I I I agree with that. I agree with that. Um, okay, so then that the last question in like marketing agency is what is something that you wish people knew like knew that most don't about what you do.
Alyssa:I think a lot of people see the fun and shiny parts, um, like the influencer boxes or the graphics and the social media posting and the happy times that you see on authors' social media um if I'm at an event with them. Um, but people don't realize that I'm constantly in ad dashboards and spreadsheets and tracking engagement and adjusting strategies when something doesn't work that I thought would work. Um, so it's just there's really a lot that goes behind the scenes, and readers and people on the outside only see the pretty shiny things. Um, but another thing is how much relationship building goes into this business. Um, I'm constantly building relationships with authors, mine and outside of my agency. Um, influencers, bookstores, podcasters. Um, so much I of what I do is making sure people feel seen and supported um all around, just to make sure that that they don't feel especially especially when it comes to like influencers and things, I don't want them to ever just feel used. Um I want I want to make sure that they're taken care of as best as possible and not just a number for a review, you know.
Jordan:No, and I I like that because I feel like too, it can sometimes come across that way with either like a like author, PA, like other marketing agency. Like I totally understand like you're there for your clients, but it's like I know like we and it kind of makes sense too. It's like we can bring something to the table too. So it's not and so just like knowing like your worth all around. And I think it it says something about you and your agency knowing that you want to make sure that you curate a relationship with everybody, not just your clients. And I think that's honestly really cool. I like that. Okay, so now we can get into reading. So, what is your favorite book and or series? A book you would recommend to anyone and everyone. And this doesn't necessarily have to be like one of your clients, it just can be like your favorite book.
Alyssa:My my all-time favorite series, um, people may laugh, but it's actually a YA series. It's a YA romance, and I'm not a big YA romance reader, but it's a it's a series that I actually listen to at least once a year. Like I just re-listen to it, and it's one of the only ones I do that with. And it's the Primin Premonition series by Amy A. Bartle. Um, it is so good. It's got it's got like angels and demons fighting, um, but you get like some vampires in there as well. Um it's it's I don't know if um you like like people finding their soulmate. Um, it's got people, it's got soulmates and things in there. Um, God, how do I explain it? It actually has been, it's time to reread it. But it is it's literally one that I listen to every year, and I force my teenage kids to read it because I love it so much.
Jordan:I I love that. I've never heard of it though. Like I didn't know where your recommendation was going, and I'm like, ooh, yeah, this sounds good.
Alyssa:Yeah, and I'm not like it starts out like she she's a human and she's going to college, so it's more, I guess you could call it more of a coming of age.
Jordan:Yeah, or like a new adult.
Alyssa:Um, I I think the sex scenes are a closed door, though. It's been a while. I need to go back and double check that. Time for your annual reread. It's time for my annual reread. Um, and it's fall, it's usually in the fall when I reread it. But it opens up one.
Jordan:Sorry, sorry. I was just gonna say, like, I don't know why, but like vampires just scream November to me, like the month. So I'm like, it's perfect time.
Alyssa:Yeah, so it starts out. She's she's going to this college, um, and she feels really drawn to this one person. He's not in college, he's an adult, he's a very rich adult. Turns out he's he's an angel and he's like fighting demons, and she falls in love with him, but he's not he doesn't have a soul, so he's not supposed to be able to fall in love. So it's a five-book series. The arc is them the entire time in all five books. Um, and you just really kind of follow like how this happened. There's a lot of twists and turns, there's a lot of plot twists. Um, so it's really good series. Wait, going back to your where my name came from.
Jordan:Yeah, I totally forgot. Wait, so is that is that where it came from?
Alyssa:Like this series, it was it was I was going through so many different names, and I was chatting with a bestie chat, and I was like, what about this name? What about this name? What about this name? And really the only one that everyone liked was plot twist, and so I went with it.
Jordan:Wait, I I mean I plot twist is a really good name, so I totally agree with that. So I'm here for it. Sorry now that I cut you off. Is there anything else you had to say for that one?
Alyssa:No, I just I just really love that series. I could probably go on all day talking about it once once it once it triggers, like usually saying something triggers like another light bulb in that book, and I could just go on all day talking about it.
Jordan:I'm here for it. I'm here for it. Um, okay, so then what is the spiciest book you have ever read?
Alyssa:Oh gosh.
Jordan:I need to think on that one. Um it doesn't necessarily have to be like the amount of spice, it could just be like, oh, this spicy scene like was amazing, you know? Or it could be like a tension scene, anything that's like in that ballpark.
Alyssa:I would have to say um birthday hex by Jennifer Rebecca. Um she cannot open a book without a bang, literally. I love it. So uh yeah, and she's also my bestie. Um, so I guess this is a weird plug because I know her personally, uh, but I always forget how much sex she writes in books until I'm actually reading them. And I'm like, I know you and your husband on a very personal level, and this is weird.
Jordan:Now you know them on an even more personal level.
Alyssa:Well, he walks around telling everyone he inspired their book boyfriend. So um But there, there you go. There, there. I'm like, Lit need to know that, but now you do.
Jordan:Um okay, so what is your favorite quote? And it could be in from a book, a poem, a quote someone once said.
Alyssa:One of my favorite quotes is actually in the signature of my personal email. I love it. Um, and it has been in the signature of my personal email for a really long time. And it's a quote from one of uh Kay Bromberg's books. She writes, she wrote the Driven series, um, with like Formula One race car drivers. Um, and I it was one of like the spin-off books. Um, and it it it what the character had is like dying of or she has cancer, um, and she thinks she's dying, but she ends up not dying. Um, spoiler alert. I can't even remember the title of this book. I need that, I need to know that. I don't want anybody dying. I'll have to go pull it and tell you after this. Um as soon as I see it on my shelf, I'll be able to tell you the title. But the quote in there is time is precious, waste it wisely. And I kind of have lived my life by that since reading that book. So I love that quote.
Jordan:I love that. Me too. Solid, solid. Um, okay. So, what is an author slash a book of theirs that you wish got more attention, like on social media or like book doc, bookstagram? That it like deserves more hype. I should have said that. I don't know why.
Alyssa:Rebecca Kinney. Um, she is like a fantasy paranormal writer. Um, and one I I worked with her at my one of my previous jobs. Uh, she was one of my authors, she got a traditional deal. Um, and one of the first books I worked on her with was um, it was Jay Gatsby, but as a vampire. So it's called Beautiful Villain. Um, so good. But her that series that she's publishing through her publishing house um is like popular stories in like a fantasy world where they get a hut happily ever after. So Jay Gatsby doesn't die at the end because he's a vampire. Um, but the next one um she did was uh the picture of Dorian Gray. Um, so I don't know if you know anything about that story. Um, but like the portrait keeps him alive, keeps him immortal, essentially, and the portrait is dying. So he's got to try to figure out how to save himself. Um so that one's fun. Book three is uh retelling of Weather and Kights, and then book four, which is the one I'm like waiting for and texting my colleagues um about because I want the arc as soon as it's ready, uh, is uh Phantom of the Opera retelling. And I'm just like, I need this, I needed this. Um, but I picked up Beautiful Villain uh as soon as we signed her and as soon as we had the edits in and literally went and binged her entire backlist and could not stop. Um, and she just really needs more attention because she's such a phenomenal writer, and her I don't know how she does it. Like, I just don't know. It's so good. She has like a dragon series that she's indie published, um, so like dragon shifters, um, where they fall. Yeah.
Jordan:Oh my god.
Alyssa:And so and it's just like I just couldn't stop. Like it was just like one after the other after the other after the other. I just could not stop reading them. So she is definitely one who needs more attention.
Jordan:Honestly, I love when I find a new author and then I just need to read everything about theirs. Like, that's just uh it's so good. It's just I love when that happens. So maybe I gotta check her out now. You do. Okay, so now we're in personal, which is the last three questions. This went by way too fast, I want to point out. Um, okay, so what is a fun fact about you that the listeners might be surprised to learn?
Alyssa:Um, I actually my original plan um when I was younger was to be a high school chemistry teacher. So half of my degree is actually in chemistry.
Jordan:Talk about a full 180.
Alyssa:Yeah. I went from STEM to liberal arts real fast.
Jordan:Real fast. Wait, did you and did you teach at all? Or were you just like, nope, we're out.
Alyssa:Oh I decided real fast that I did not like dealing with children um that weren't my own. And I was like, I would probably get fired. Um so um I still love chemistry. My uh one of my children is in a chemistry class right now. So um I'm having fun getting to kind of get back into that side of my brain, um, the more analytical side, and um help her learn chemistry, which is one of it's one of my other loves.
Jordan:So oh, I love that. Well, I I want to point out so in high school, when I was in high school like years ago, I did like this TA thing where I went to the elementary school and helped like teachers out. And I did it two years. I did it my junior and senior year. I and my junior year, I was like, maybe I could be a teacher. Like, granted, I'm in high school. I'm like, okay, I could go to college and become like a teacher. Like, maybe this is something I want to do. Oh my gosh, did I realize that I could be a teacher for one year? Like, in the sense of I get so loyal, like I don't know if loyal is the right word, but I get so attached to these group of kids that I'm like that first year would be amazing. And then my senior year, I was like, the fuck are you? Like, why do I have to help you? Like, if I could just grow with the students, I think that would be great. But having new students every year, I was like, I was over it. And I was like, I and I was like, I could never be a teacher.
Alyssa:Yeah, having um, we I have we have educated a lot of educational people in my family, and talking to them, that was one of their struggles when they started out teaching was having to have new students every year. So you wouldn't have been the only one. Um, they and I actually one of my daughter's teachers actually has moved up every year.
Jordan:I feel like that's what I would have to do because I I got so attached to them by the end of the year that I'm like, wait, I don't want to say bye. And I don't want another group of students to have to like help. I was like so over it.
Alyssa:I just I just got to the point where the disrespect to teachers got so bad that I was like, no, I'd slap a kid and get fired.
Jordan:Don't talk to me that way. Honestly, understandable because some of them were horrible.
Alyssa:I was like, I really admire our teachers. I'm really good friends with a lot of our teachers. We live in a tiny town, so it's not hard to do. Um, but yeah, some of the stories I hear really solidifies the fact that I did not go into teaching.
Jordan:Fair, fair. Um, if you could give your life a romance book title, what would it be? Oh god. This is my favorite question. It's just like, and it doesn't need to be like your romance life, it's just your life, but like a romance title. Maybe I should change that to book title. I don't want you to think you're love life or anything.
Alyssa:No, um I don't know. I mean that's a this is a good question. I didn't know I didn't make it down the list this far when I was prepping for this interview. So this was just this one actually took me off guard. I'm usually really good. I don't know. Oh god. I don't know. Um maybe life's full of surprises, I guess. I don't know. I like it. I would I was gonna try to come up with one for you about like with plot twists, like I got pregnant really young, had to quit college, went to college with with two toddlers, tried to do chemistry, changed that. So plot twist actually does work. Yeah, you you it does.
Jordan:Um, okay, so now the last question: what is one future goal that you would like to achieve, either long term or short term, short term? And it could be anything, it could be with like reading, your agency, personal. What's just a future goal you have?
Alyssa:Uh for my agency. I really would like to see an author hit the New York Times list being indie. Um, it is nearly impossible. Um, it's nearly impossible to hit the USA Today list being indie now since they changed it a few years ago. Um, but one of one of my big business goals is to have at least one New York Times bestseller indie book.
Jordan:I like that. Um, I'm sorry though, what what changed about it? I don't know.
Alyssa:Uh they uh it's all um algorithmic now. They used to have someone that curated it um based off numbers, um Mary Caden, um, who's a phenomenal person and I like cried the day they let her go. Um, but it is now based off an algorithm. Um they pull in data from Amazon and all the other retailers to get accurate and and book scan to get accurate numbers. Um and a lot of times it just leaves off ebooks. There a lot of times it's focused on paperbacks. Um, I've seen I've seen paperbacks that only sold 200 hit the USA Today bestseller list. Meanwhile, you have indie authors out here selling 17 to 20k ebooks and not even looking at the list. Um, so it's definitely very frustrating. It is very frustrating to kind of see um indie authors got the shaft again. New York Times changed probably seven or eight years ago. They used to have an ebook only list, um, and they dropped it because indie authors were dominating it and it is now a print and combined list or print and ebook list. Um, they call it the combined list. So yeah, it it's one of those things where where it's really not fair to indie authors um who aren't dealing with the gatekeeping of traditional publishing, um, who are out here hustling and spending their own money and and really outselling a lot of these traditional published books, um, but not making, not getting the attention that they deserve on this things like that.
Jordan:Well, and it's like frustrating too, because I don't know if you do you subscribe to the shelf awareness emails.
Alyssa:I do.
Jordan:I okay. So do you see, you know, occasionally at the bottom of the list there'll be like top self-publishing titles? It's so frustrating because you see traditionally published titles on there, and I'm like, I know that's with Red Tower, I know that's with Bloom, I know that's with all these, and I'm like Yeah, that part of their list is actually the indie publishing houses, not indie authors or or indie bookstores.
Alyssa:Um, because like there's a I think there's a bit of um language. It's because on the traditionally published side, they call indie authors self-published authors. Um and then um the indies, when we say indies on traditional publishing, they're talking about the bookstores. So it's like the top indie, the top books that sold in the indie bookstores. Does that make sense?
Jordan:Uh wait. So then it could be traditionally published books? Yeah. Oh no. So I'm just oh, I've been reading that email wrong.
Alyssa:I've been getting so angry. Um, and that's that's why you're the top seller in like an indie bookstore. So outside of Barnes and Noble, Books a Million, um, the airports, um, Hudson, Walmart. No, no.
Jordan:I'm so glad I've talked to you because honestly, it's been well, because like it's so weird because I feel like before they happened to be a lot of self-published authors, indie authors on this list. So then only recently I've been seeing like these traditionally published books, and I've been getting frustrated on why it's like I think they've been there recently.
Alyssa:I think they did have some self-published stuff, but typically shelf awareness is is looking at bookstores. Um and and your your indie authors are gonna be more ebook sellers um than anything. Okay, that that makes sense now. I'm really glad I brought it up because I had no idea. That's that's the thing, is like I can speak both traditional and indie because I've worked in both sides. Um, and so sometimes like learning the traditional way was interesting coming from the indie side because I always come in and I'd be like indie this and indie that, and they're like, Are you talking about bookstores? I'm like, I'm not talking about bookstores, I'm talking about this indie author.
Jordan:That's so good to know. So if it's indies, if you say indie in the trad in the like traditional seller book read, yeah, you know what I mean. Um, it's indie bookstores, and then self-published would be self-published authors, indie authors like that. You just yeah.
Alyssa:Right.
Jordan:Okay, good to know. Good to know.
Alyssa:Yeah, so just a just a bit of a a separation there. Um I mean, uh all self-published authors call themselves indies on the indie side.
Jordan:Um, yeah, see, that's why I think I always just thought they were like interchange interchangeable, which I'm assume, I guess like in a way they are, but like if you're talking about indie like shelf awareness traditionally published side, it's bookstores.
Alyssa:You're looking at the indie bookstore. So so you're looking at like the top sellers in um in places like your local bookstore, whether you know that uh just anything outside of Walmart, Target, Barnes and Noble, Books a Mill and Books A Million I think in Hudson, which is airports.
Jordan:So thank you for answering that question. Um okay, well, so that's the it. I wanted to give you the floor. I wanted you to like plug yourself in any way that you wanted to.
Alyssa:I don't know. Um this has been a really good interview. I've really enjoyed talking to you. I've enjoyed kind of getting to say out loud uh all the things that have been in my head about my own company. Um that's been a lot of fun.
Jordan:Um but really like thank you so much for letting me interview you. Well, actually, so we you can plug yourself for um bookstagrammers and book talkers. Like, where can they like apply to get um see like arcs that are available? Like, is there a website or Instagram, TikTok?
Alyssa:So I have my master um like influencer list. Um you can get it on the link in my Instagram bio and on my website, there's uh it's influencers in the menu. Um and there's it's just a Google form right now. I'm gonna eventually move it over to Airtable probably. Um, but it you can fill it out and you're on my list. And when like I ask for like what subgenres in the in romance that you like. And if I have one that I think you'd be interested in, I will reach out and see if you're interested in reading or reviewing it.
Jordan:What is your handle? Like, what is the marketing agency's handle? Twist marketing, plot twist marketing. Perfect. And then I'm okay, and then I'm guessing it's like www.plot twistmarketing.com. Oh, perfect. Well, yeah, hear that. Hear that. You heard that here, guys. Um, yeah. So if you're an influencer and want to like see all that's going on with plot twist marketing, you definitely want to sign up. And oh my gosh, thank you so much for letting me interview you. This was the most fun, the most fun.
Alyssa:This has been a lot of fun. Just love you so much. Can we do this again sometime?
Jordan:Honestly, please. Like, I feel like I already have more questions I want to ask you. So, and now that you've said it, I'm gonna bring you back.
Alyssa:Let's do it. Perfect.